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Post by marcuslee on May 10, 2008 21:09:47 GMT -5
I think that Run Basic is a very good idea, and I hope it continues to grow. I hope eventually that it is just as popular as any other way to create a website. However ...
In the mean time, how does one know if a hosting service supports RB? Most hosting services wouldn't have heard of RB, much less actually support it.
What would be needed for a hosting service to support it? Would they need to do something on their end? Or, is it simply a space issue?
I would like to use RB, and my wife is in the early stages of a new business, so I may have need for RB very soon, but none of the options that I've seen here on this forum are viable. I don't want to host it on my personal computer. And, sorry Carl, not really interested in hosting it with your service. Perfect scenario: I would like to use it with some 3rd-party hosting service, but I don't know how to go about finding out if they would be able to support it because I haven't seen any information regarding that route. Help!
Mark
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Post by Jerry Muelver on May 10, 2008 21:34:03 GMT -5
You could just ask the service if they support RB. If they don't, or don't know about RB, put them in touch with Carl.
BTW, what would you expect to pay for RB-supported hosting? I know where you can get a virtual dedicated server for only about $100 a month, or $120 a month with off-server backup capability.
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Post by Carl Gundel - admin on May 10, 2008 21:38:17 GMT -5
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Post by marcuslee on May 10, 2008 22:20:50 GMT -5
I guess my main problem here is information. I don't know how any of this works. I read a wiki article on virtual hosting after reading Carl's post. I think I understand it, but I do not want to pay a $100/month for that. Right now I have a webpage with 1and1.com (a hosting service), and I pay a little over $4/month. It's simple basic package. Similar plans on other hosting services allow you to have custom CGI scripts, PHP, Ruby, etc ... and all you have to pay is between $5 and $10 per month. I want to be able to buy the Personal version and use it with a hosting service. Or, am I misunderstanding how RB works? Would a hosting service have to intergrade it into their system if we are to be able to use it? I'm not interested in Carl's hosting services because at the moment it seems to be in a testing phase. Plus, I want all of the other features that a 3rd party hosting service provides. I want to be able to register a domain name, for instance. You could just ask the service if they support RB. If they don't, or don't know about RB, put them in touch with Carl. BTW, what would you expect to pay for RB-supported hosting? I know where you can get a virtual dedicated server for only about $100 a month, or $120 a month with off-server backup capability. What would I expect to pay? No more than $10/month. I don't want to pay much more than I pay now, really. I don't mind buying RB if I can intergrade it into a hosting service. If I find a hosting service that supports RB or is willing to support it, who would buy it? Me or the hosting service? If the hosting service were to buy it, could all of their users have access to it? By the way, I did call one hosting service and told them about Run Basic, and I know the technician went to the site because he read a sentence from the website out loud. So, what if we all call hosting services? ... maybe they would pick it up, which would be good for Carl, I assume. Mark
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Post by mackrackit on May 11, 2008 2:30:19 GMT -5
I hope the problems I have been having are not influencing you. I have been using RB on my servers since January and have found it to be very, very stable. The problem I have been having with the hosting service that Carl and Jerry have set up is very minor and I believe it is from something I am doing. Have you seen this? janetterra.com/SamplingsRB.htmIt is a very nice example of how RB from one server can be used with another. Yes I am talking about two host, but that is one way to have it all until other hosting companies start providing RB. Just some of my thoughts.
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Post by Jerry Muelver on May 11, 2008 6:01:08 GMT -5
Mark says: Everything comes at a price. The price for hosting that includes CGI, PHP, Ruby, ASP, JSP, etc. is that you have to know all those technologies before you can use them. So, the cost is in the learning and studying and failing and trying again. It's the same with RB, except that learning and studying and failing and trying again process is drastically shortened, so your cost is lower. Best of all, you only have to learn ONE programming technology, not half-a-dozen, to get the job done. With RunBASICnet, you could do all your programming online, on the RB server included with the subscription. Most RunBASICnet folks find it much smarter to use their own personal RB for development, so they won't be interfering with their users by programming while users are trying to use. This is a common paradigm for all web programming technologies -- you develop off-site, and post it when it's ready to fly. The hosting service would buy it, if they were offering support for it. The would regain the cost in their hosting fees. For a dedicated or virtual server, you would buy it, install it, and do your own support. Of course RunBASICnet is in a testing phase! No one else has ever done RB hosting before! RunBASICnet is unabashedly and openly in a testing, pilot, development phase. You aren't going to find anyone, anywhere on the planet, with more experience hosting RB, and you never will! They will all be following the leader. That's how it is, when your rocket is the first to launch.
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Post by Alyce on May 11, 2008 7:09:49 GMT -5
Of course RunBASICnet is in a testing phase! No one else has ever done RB hosting before! RunBASICnet is unabashedly and openly in a testing, pilot, development phase. You aren't going to find anyone, anywhere on the planet, with more experience hosting RB, and you never will! They will all be following the leader. That's how it is, when your rocket is the first to launch. Jerry is (perhaps) too modest. He literally wrote the book, er, books on web programming. Creating Cool Web Pages With Perl by Jerry Muelver was published in 1996 and he co-authored The Visual J++ Bible shortly after that. He's also been using Liberty BASIC, by the same author as Run BASIC, for many years. If anybody can make this work, it's Jerry.
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Post by marcuslee on May 11, 2008 10:29:57 GMT -5
Thank you for the information y'all have provided. Since financhial issues are at the core of my dilemma, and the purpose of using RB was to communicate better with our potential customers, I think it is best to wait. When RB hits the main stream, I will certainly use it over other methods. In the mean time, from what I can see, I don't need to know these other languages to manage a website. Most of it is automated, the "webmaster" never seeing code, outside of a little HTML.
I may be wrong, but it seems I can manage an online Cart. I've looked at a couple of systems (Paypal to name one), and all that is involved is a little HTML. I would like to have greater control over the information, but that will come in time. After all, we haven't even officially started the business.
And, I think I can figure out how to do some online forms for customer reaction surveys. I'll have the results sent to me through email. That was another thing that I would like to eventually use RB for. Instead of emailing me when someone fills out an online form (or in addition to), I would simply log in and manage the results myself. Once again, in time.
Those are two things that I think would be easier to do with RB. Well, maybe not easier since I am a follow-the-manual-step-by-step-programmer. At least I would have greater control over how my website operates. In the mean time, hosting services cater to businesses who want to do this, and they seem to make it easy. We'll see.
Once again, thank you for your insights, all of you.
Mark
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Post by marcuslee on May 11, 2008 10:38:08 GMT -5
My earlier suggestion of contacting hosting services is still a valid one, methinks. We could do a telephone tree, having Run Basic users contact all the major hosting services and do a sales pitch. I called Host Monster yesterday. The technician seemed intrigued, but I don't know enough about RB to really make a detailed sales pitch. All I can do is point them to RunBasic.com, which I did.
The technician did have the idea that they had to be running a Windows server in order to use Run Basic. He got the idea from the main page of RunBasic.com. I don't know enough about web technology to correct him. I assume he misunderstood.
Perhaps, though, it would be best for hosting services to adopt RB once the current testing phase is a little further along. You don't want a hosting service calling you everyday because they can't get their system to work right. In any case, getting the word out couldn't hurt.
Mark
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Post by Jerry Muelver on May 11, 2008 10:54:37 GMT -5
The tech understood correctly. RB (so far) needs a Windows server to run on. That's how RunBASICnet.com does it, and they're the ones who should know.
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Post by StefanPendl on May 11, 2008 17:07:38 GMT -5
The technician did have the idea that they had to be running a Windows server in order to use Run Basic. As Jerry says, the current version is Windows only, but if I recall correctly, at least a Linux version is planned. There seems to be a chance to get more interest, when the Linux version is available.
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kyrb
New Member
Posts: 12
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Post by kyrb on May 11, 2008 17:52:10 GMT -5
Jerry and Carl,
How much disk space and transfer per month is included in your runbasicnet.com hosting plan? (If this is on your web site, I didn't see it).
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Post by Jerry Muelver on May 11, 2008 20:27:01 GMT -5
About as much as you need. So, how much is that?
We're not worried about disk space and transfer quantities at the moment, since we are trying to find out, by direct experience, just how much is really needed. I would discourage using RunBASICnet as a file-swapping repository, however. The idea is to do Run BASIC programming for stuff that you can't easily do some other way.
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kyrb
New Member
Posts: 12
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Post by kyrb on May 11, 2008 21:36:26 GMT -5
I pay $10 per mo for Netw*k Solu*ns standard Windows hosting. 25gb disk space, 150gb transfer and I don't come close to using that. That includes MySQL and SQLserver database services, but I've had mysterious problems running PHP and CGI programs on their server, and it seems like I'm having to peel back layers of info from their support staff. For example, it seems as though some words used in code are reserved, but no one can/will tell what the list is.
Static hosting and availability is fine, programmable is not, it seems.
So anyway, I'm thinking that if RB works out, I'll probably be interested in moving all of my stuff here, since the cost would be the same.
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Post by Jerry Muelver on May 12, 2008 5:40:54 GMT -5
I pay $120/month for a dedicated Windows 2003 server, 2 gig RAM, 250 gig drive, one static IP, running my own HTTP server (Win IIS at the moment), my own FTP (FileZilla) server, doing my own management via Remote Desktop (on a 19.2kbaud dial-up!), running 7 RB servers (one per account) each using from 12-23 meg of RAM and 25 meg disk space to start. Ability to host individual domains and separate IPs would cost an additional $50 per month, so we'll have to wait on that option for a while. Technical support consists of my brand-new copy of "Windows Server 2003 Bible", in which I have already read 16 of 1184 pages. My wife finds my business model at bit suspect at the present time, but when I told her Google will probably buy us out for a billion dollars or so by the end of the year, she agreed it was worth a shot.
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